| Discussions on User Beast Puzzles |
Naivoj
Kwon-Tom Addict
Puzzles: 314
Best Total: 33m 50s | Posted - 2008.02.03 04:43:17
I am starting this topic specifically to discuss the User Beast Puzzles separately from the "User Beast Puzzles- Loopy Strings" topic, where the word wrapping is not working because of the excessive length of the loopy strings.
Quote: Originally Posted by astrokath Can we assume they're comparable in difficulty to the average monthly beast, rather than this month's nightmarish concoction? |
- 1:2008/02, 2:2007/04, 3:2006/02, 4:2006/10, 5:2005/10, 6:2006/04, 7:2006/06.
- June2007 which MondSemmel considers among the hardest only ranks 21/34.
Last edited by Naivoj - 2008.02.03 05:08:33 |
Naivoj
Kwon-Tom Addict
Puzzles: 314
Best Total: 33m 50s | Posted - 2008.02.03 05:07:41
Quote: Originally Posted by puzzlelover Thanks for the puzzles, Naivoj. I tried your Beast #002. But it doesn't qualify as easy in my book. For starters, basic patterns left large parts of the puzzle unpopulated.
It seems to use more counting than foilman's beasts, which is fine.
I seemed to need lots of trial and error, and lots of that was inconclusive. That makes a hard puzzle.
Alas, I reached a point with "iron clad logic" (including plenty of T&E) where there's an ambiguous connection. Highlander says I must have made a mistake somewhere earlier, but I've no clue where. When I spend hours on a difficult puzzle like that just to discover some unknown error, I'm inclined to abandon it.
So, sorry your "easy" puzzle isn't easy for me. If you have a lookahead parameter in your generator, could you dial it down some to make a beast that's easier for mortals? |
Last edited by Naivoj - 2008.02.03 05:19:59 |
PuzzleLover
Kwon-Tom Obsessive
Puzzles: 1033
Best Total: 38m 17s | Posted - 2008.02.04 05:14:22
Thanks for the offer, Naivoj, but I don't know how to post a file somewhere to link to. The unsolved portions (upper left, bottom middle, middle/lower right) are all too large for the puzzle editor here.
FWIW I got almost as far without T&E this time (still needed T&E for the lower right corner), and I noticed a right edge spot I'd filled before that might be my mistake. Several subtle counting/shading deductions (0 or 2 edges, deductions across unfilled edges) were needed. I'm sure working it before helped to see them.
If you email me at cscott2 at comcast.net I can email you the loopy save file. Is there a way to make loopy save the current state as a simple description string instead of a full blown save file with history? I didn't see one. |
Naivoj
Kwon-Tom Addict
Puzzles: 314
Best Total: 33m 50s | Posted - 2008.02.04 09:58:48
Quote: Originally Posted by puzzlelover If you email me at cscott2 at comcast.net I can email you the loopy save file. Is there a way to make loopy save the current state as a simple description string instead of a full blown save file with history? I didn't see one. |
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PuzzleLover
Kwon-Tom Obsessive
Puzzles: 1033
Best Total: 38m 17s | Posted - 2008.02.05 01:56:01
Hi, sorry I typo'ed my email address. It's cscotth2 at comcast.net . Thanks for your willingness to take a look. |
Naivoj
Kwon-Tom Addict
Puzzles: 314
Best Total: 33m 50s | Posted - 2008.02.05 02:21:05
Quote: Originally Posted by puzzlelover Hi, sorry I typo'ed my email address. It's cscotth2 at comcast.net . Thanks for your willingness to take a look. |
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penthf
Kwon-Tom Obsessive
Puzzles: 509
Best Total: 35m 11s | Posted - 2008.02.06 21:07:19
For hosting files externally, I can strongly recommend RapidShare!
RapidShare
Hosting and downloading are for free, and no registration is needed.
You have to wait for about one minute before the download starts. (Enough time for some of you to finish half of the weekly challenge, I suppose...) |
chairman
Kwon-Tom Obsessive
Puzzles: 1397
Best Total: 17m 32s | Posted - 2008.02.07 12:17:58
Quote: Originally Posted by naivoj In my book the 7 hardest ones are (out of the 34 posted):
- 1:2008/02, 2:2007/04, 3:2006/02, 4:2006/10, 5:2005/10, 6:2006/04, 7:2006/06.
- June2007 which MondSemmel considers among the hardest only ranks 21/34. |
Thanks again for the puzzles. In my opinion, March 2007 is the beastiest beast.
Quote: Originally Posted by naivoj The reason I mark it (#2) as easy is that it if you use color patterns and highlander patterns everything is forced and no trial and error is required at all. |
That is impressive. I think I'll try and learn to apply Rapidshare to show a point at which I got stuck. |
Naivoj
Kwon-Tom Addict
Puzzles: 314
Best Total: 33m 50s | Posted - 2008.02.08 00:42:15
Quote: Originally Posted by chairman In my opinion, March 2007 is the beastiest beast. |
Quote: Originally Posted by chairman ..., #2, ... I think I'll try and learn to apply Rapidshare to show a point at which I got stuck. |
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chairman
Kwon-Tom Obsessive
Puzzles: 1397
Best Total: 17m 32s | Posted - 2008.02.08 18:48:21
When solving #2 for the second time, I almost closed the loop without trial and error. The remainder could be finished by heart. Still I am curious how it can be solved by patterns. Here is the endgame (Rapidshare is easy indeed!). |
Naivoj
Kwon-Tom Addict
Puzzles: 314
Best Total: 33m 50s | Posted - 2008.02.09 04:42:05
Quote: Originally Posted by chairman When solving #2 ... Still I am curious how it can be solved by patterns. |
Last edited by Naivoj - 2008.02.09 04:43:50 |
chairman
Kwon-Tom Obsessive
Puzzles: 1397
Best Total: 17m 32s | Posted - 2008.02.09 23:01:25
Now I finally fully see the surplus value of color rules! The 'diagonal direction color rule' tells that the big (known to be red) question mark at the top row and the spot surrounded by small question marks at the second row have opposite colors (so the latter is yellow). The same rule tells that the ? at the middle row is red, then it tells that the spot left of the 3 is yellow. Since the 3 is known to be yellow, there must be a cross west of the 3! This solves the complete endgame. I would never have found this myself.
What I do not see is where you apply the clues 1-2 color pattern.
Last edited by chairman - 2008.02.09 23:02:54 |
Naivoj
Kwon-Tom Addict
Puzzles: 314
Best Total: 33m 50s | Posted - 2008.02.10 01:30:29
Quote: Originally Posted by chairman What I do not see is where you apply the clues 1-2 color pattern. |
For the record here is the (unnecessary) 1-2 color deduction I made. Using the same 5x5 Chairman puzzle cut, the 1 is @c5r3 and is red the 2 is @c4r2 and the square at the top of the 2 is also red: given the (yellow) color of the ? square (it also gives 2 crosses that are already there in Chairman endgame position)
Could this prove Prj wrong when he claims that any deduction made by color (shading) can also be made by counting:
Quote: Originally Posted by prj Quote: Originally Posted by dizzy How can anyone solve these puzzles without shading!? |
Any deduction made by shading could also be made by counting. (Trace a separate loop through the puzzle - it must cross the puzzle loop an even number of times.) The spots where you can make progress from these deductions become more visible with shading (like Xs do for other deductions), but you can get by with just counting. |
So, Prj can you complete this puzzle (#2) without trial and error, color deduction or intuition deduction ?
- Note that highlander is required. |
prj
Kwon-Tom Obsessive
Puzzles: 2356
Best Total: 18m 20s | Posted - 2008.02.11 06:50:04
Quote: Originally Posted by naivoj So, Prj can you complete this puzzle (#2) without trial and error, color deduction or intuition deduction ? |
I don't have Loopy (nor a Windows machine on which to run it, nor a printer to do it on paper). If it's playable on the web, I can give it a try. |
Naivoj
Kwon-Tom Addict
Puzzles: 314
Best Total: 33m 50s | Posted - 2008.02.11 09:17:38
Quote: Originally Posted by prj I don't have Loopy (nor a Windows machine on which to run it, nor a printer to do it on paper). If it's playable on the web, I can give it a try. |
The German site Slither Link [janko.at] http://www.janko.at/Raetsel/Slitherlink/index.htm has 21 web playable 45x30 puzzles. Can somebody tells if this site allows users to post puzzle? I can't figure this out, as I do not understand German.
- Note that the janko.at link I just post is not working for me (that is why I insert the url address as text).
I double check everything and I don't see what is wrong?
Last edited by Naivoj - 2008.02.11 09:21:37 |
procrastinator
Kwon-Tom Obsessive
Puzzles: 1083
Best Total: 12m 56s | Posted - 2008.02.11 14:45:42
Quote: Originally Posted by naivoj Note that the janko.at link I just post is not working for me (that is why I insert the url address as text). I double check everything and I don't see what is wrong? |
Your URL is missing some capitals. |
foilman
Kwon-Tom Admin
Puzzles: 3587
Best Total: 24m 6s | Posted - 2008.02.11 17:57:04
The new and improved version of the puzzle solver here will allow you to solve beasts online... although they might be a bit small/fiddly to do! It's hopefully coming soon (within the next month maybe?) and basically is a straightforward replacement of the current javascript puzzle solver with a new Abode Flash version. This works at massive sizes without slowing to a crawl, and can be easily scaled. Of course, the current javascript version will still be available for those who don't like Flash (I know there are some!) so don't panic... |
Naivoj
Kwon-Tom Addict
Puzzles: 314
Best Total: 33m 50s | Posted - 2008.02.11 20:03:52
Quote: Originally Posted by procrastinator Your URL is missing some capitals. |
Quote: Originally Posted by foilman The new and improved version of the puzzle solver here will allow you to solve beasts online... although they might be a bit small/fiddly to do!..., and can be easily scaled. |
Last edited by Naivoj - 2008.02.11 20:05:15 |
Jankonyex
Kwon-Tom Obsessive
Puzzles: 5680
Best Total: 9m 35s | Posted - 2008.02.11 20:21:25
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chairman
Kwon-Tom Obsessive
Puzzles: 1397
Best Total: 17m 32s | Posted - 2008.02.11 21:05:43
Should not the middle line of blue characters be o o o e ?
edit: No it should not. Apologies.
Last edited by chairman - 2008.02.11 22:16:11 |
